Superman Through the Ages! Forum

Hey guys.

I'm new here and I was wondering if someone could answer a few questions for me.


1.  Is pre-crisis Superman immortal?



2.  What are his greatest feats that are not listed on the site?  I read somewhere that he once defeated the enitre Green Lantern Corps.

Probably not. There are future stories in which his descendants have taken over his role. Here's one. (http://superman.nu/tales3/2965/) There's also stories which establish that Supey will grow old, like this one. (http://superman.nu/tales2/ghost/)

Superman has at least a vastly extended lifespan according to "The Ghost of Superman Future".  It suggests that though he would look older that his powers would not diminish.  He even says in the story that ordinary humans like Lex die when they get old which underscores how his lifespan is either vastly greater or he's immortal.

But "The Exile at the Edge of Eternity" ( http://superman.nu/a/400/exile/ ) does suggest he will eventually die.  But it's unclear whether he died from aging or trauma as in battle.  Given his lifestyle, it's a good chance he died in combat saving others.

Superman might die at some point, but exactly what death is for Superman might not be what it is for everybody else.

Heck, he might even be able to change it for everyone else.  That would be a pretty cool super-feat.

I could use my first post on these boards to make some sort of "clever" comment that Superman will never die so long as there are fans who appreciate him and children who idolize him, but my guess is that many of you wouldn't buy that.

To me the Pre-Crisis Superman would live for an extremely long time, though probably not into the 30th Century as the Legion of Super-Heroes was inspired by the legend of Superboy not the legend of an extant Superman.  As extensive as my knowledge of Superman is I bow to the superior wisdom of those who have read those issues of the Legion just in case I may be wrong.

On a more philosophical note I don't think an immortal Superman is an appealing idea.  As much as I love the character and as much as I enjoy reading/watching/listening to his adventures and exploits making a character like Superman immortal is a bad idea.  I mean it's great to have a character like Superman or Batman or even the Lone Ranger where there are endless adventures where good always triumphs over evil, but at some point all things must come to an end.  For Superman it would be nice to have his death be a peaceful one at the end of a long and distinguished career surrounded by those who are still alive that he cares for.

Of course, that could just be me.

According to Superman #400, Superman disappeared sometime during the 21st century.  People fully expected him to return so they kept setting a place for him for Miracle Monday dinner up until at least the 60th century.

http://superman.nu/a/400/dinner/?page=9

"The Ghost of Superman Future" does state that between journalists finding a 130 year old Superman and the time the nations of Earth saw him again, he had passed from legend to myth.  That would suggest that Superman did live at least several more centuries, perhaps a millenium given the 'myth' statement, beyond the 21st century.

http://superman.nu/tales2/ghost/?page=8

In DC One Million (Post Crisis), this was further elaborated upon so that Superman still left Earth towards the close of the 21st century.  But in this version, it was said he had lost his reason for staying on Earth since his wife, friends, and family had all passed away.  So, he set out on adventures to the Edge of the universe.

All of the above explain how Superman could be alive in the 30th/31st century and not be interacting with the Legion or the United Planets.  He simply had left Earth and its area of influence on some personal quest.

Y'know, I think the best depiction of Superman's death actually comes from Smallville.  The cape flowing past, the stars turning into streaks ... although that death-foretelling kid did say that Clark doesn't die like everybody else.  It was pretty vague.

IIRC, didn't that Smallville kid say Clark seems to go on forever?

Something like that.  I don't remember exactly.  Somebody around here must have it on DVD, wanna check for us?

Superman isn't immortal. He can be killed -- so he is mortal.

When it comes to his lifespan, I take the view his lifespan is finite, ie. with inbuilt limits, as it is with any man.

How long would a normal man live, if he could live on the best, freshly-harvested produce, drinking clean water, with no air pollution, no boredom or stress in his life ever, no arguments or fights, ie. an environment of perfect harmony? Who knows. A hundred and twenty years? A hundred and fifty?

I think Superman will live as long as a normal man. He was conceived, was born, grew, matured, is aging, and so he will die, just like any man. He is as much a living part of this process as we are. His eventual end is pre-programmed, it is built-in, part of the biological process that is a man. He may well take the process to human limits, but not beyond.

Nice presentation of your POV, Aldous.

I think canon publications tend to give him extremely long life to virtual immortality, immortality in the sense the barring accidents he could live forever.

It must be noted that in "The Greatest Green Lantern of All!" that Kal-El was supposed to be the replacement for the immortal Guardians in leading the Green Lantern Corps.  That would seem to suggest that Kal himself is an immortal due to his genetic perfection else the Guardians wouldn't bother with a being whose lifespace is quite ephemeral compared with theirs.

And, BTW, though it's rare, Guardians have been killed though they're considered otherwise immortal, too.

Immortality does not mean unkillable it just means you cannot die of 'natural causes'  There is a Greek story where goddess asks that her mortal lover be granted immortality. Sadly the goddess did not ask for eteran youth and the lover shrived up from old age into a grasshopper.

Immortality does not mean you "cannot die of 'natural causes'". Immortality is defined as the quality of being immortal. :P

Seriously though, being immortal in the literal sense means you are not subject to death, ergo completely unkillable. Which is why Superman gets tacked with "virtual immortality" because to a lot of interpretations he fits your idea of immortality, i.e. immune to death by natural causes. :)

You still don't get it. Read Jonathan Swift's Gulliver's Travels and about the Strulbrugs the immortals who cannot die of old age or disease but can[/b] be killed and this is in a novel written in 1726. Furthermore Vampire in most mythologies are described as 'immortal' even that you can kill them. The deities of the Hindu pantheon were said to be immortal but even they could die by violence as could the beings of the Faerie Relam. The same is true of the Sanjiyan Unkara and their Wu in the 3x3 eyes manga.

Face it the reality is immortal does not mean unkillable.

When it comes to Superman’s immortality, does anyone even know the average life span of a Kryptonian? It seemed like the people in Kandor never seemed to age, and Supergirls parents always looked to be the same age as when Krypton blew up, even taking in the fact they spent several years in the survival zone they should still be into their 40’s or 50’s but the time Supergirl grew up.  Maybe Superman isn’t immortal but it’s just natural for him to have a very long life span.

Umm yes it does, immortal literally means unkillable. All the examples you cite may have been called "immortal" in their source material, but are only virtually so as in certain circumstances they CAN be killed. It's like many people refer to Superman as invulnerable (including Superman himself) but he isn't, he's VIRTUALLY invulnerable because he CAN be harmed, it just takes a lot.

im·mor·tal   Audio pronunciation of "immortal" ( P )  Pronunciation Key  (-môrtl)
adj.

   1. Not subject to death: immortal deities; the immortal soul.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=immortal

I can cite too: Thesaurus definition (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/immortal):

"2. any supernatural being worshipped as controlling some part of the world or some aspect of life or who is the personification of a force"

Note that this definiton says nothing about dieing. The defintion you gave is just like the one creationists used to cite for science back in the 1980's which excluded all the social sciences and just as flawed.