Superman Through the Ages! Forum

is up at CBR:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=preview&id=9892

by George Pérez & Jesús Merino

I saw this. Looks decent. I like the way they're making the costume work, how they're referencing his increasing power level, and how people still only mostly trust Superman.

Mostly, I'm interested in Human Torch up there. What is it, where's it from, is it really from Krypton? How much does Superman know about Krypton? It's likely a newer concept to Superman, I think he's unaware of it in Action Comics so far. I'll definitely pick this book up.

Is ( sorry, I haven't been keeping up to date ) ,  action comics 1 out now?

Yes, Action #1 is out.  I posted my thoughts about it here (http://superman.nu/smf/index.php?topic=4017.0).

I recently picked up Swamp Thing #1, which has a Superman guest appearance.  I have to say, the new costume here is g*dawful.  Here is one page of the three I scanned:

(http://superman.nu/superman-comics/images/superman-swampthing-scan-1.jpg)

After seeing multiple pages of this, the ad at the end of the book was a breath of fresh air.

(http://superman.nu/superman-comics/images/superman-swampthing-scan-3.jpg)

(http://superman.nu/superman-comics/images/superman-swampthing-scan-2.jpg)

I think this will be as short-lived as the electro-blue (http://superman.nu/portal/Encyclopaedia/entries/index.php?entry=energy) costume was.

As you know, I'm not reading these comics, but looking at those pictures of Superman's new duds I realized that he probably has a lot of problems with his joints like me. He's twenty years older than me, so I imagine it's getting really tough for him. These days I've been thinking it'd be nice to have some kind of exoskeleton to do the work for my joints, especially for my knee--since some days I can hardly walk a block without being in pain. I've tried knee braces, but they only seem to make the problem worse. Superman seems to have figured out how to overcome the joint pains that come with aging, so he can stay employed in his old career. I'm envious.

So what was the last pre flashpoint superman comic?

Word is that George Perez will leave the series after issue 6. Keith Giffen and Dan Jurgens are supposed to replace him, I don't know about Moreno.

Complaints about the 1st issue on other message boards seem to say that the story was too wordy or too old school.

I didn't pick up the book--all I have to go on is the CBR preview pages--but even though I'm no fan of the relaunch nor of Perez as a writer (though I love him as an artist), I was impressed by those pages. If I'm being objective and not judging them according to my own personal bias against the relaunch and all the things that have been done to the characters. As just basic comic book storytelling, those pages look good. The visuals are strong, the inking is great. The use of text works, because Perez is doing a collage of narratives. The wordiness has a purpose and it's not entirely for the sake of being expository, but rather to show different levels of text and how they cohere and contrast. And it's a first issue, so we're being introduced to the characters and their milieu through these different levels of storytelling which all meet on the comic page.

I guess this makes me old school, because I don't see the defect that others see. Granted, though, I'm just going by the sample of the preview pages. But I wonder if younger readers just don't like having to read a lot of text and they have come to think that "good" comics are just a lot of pictures and very little text.

Anyway, even though I have no desire to see the DC relaunch succeed, I like Mr. Perez and I hope he's doing okay.

The problem, to me, is not that it's too wordy. The problem is the style of writing that Perez chose for the issue. Specifically, it felt like his first issue of Action Comics in the late '80s after Byrne left. Big cast of characters, focus on the Daily Planet and Clark Kent, but not Superman. That style may have worked in the past when Superman had 3 inter-connected titles, stories spilled over from one issue to the next, and comics were less than 1 USD. But, when you only have two books and one is set 5 years in the past? That's a lot of ground to cover and you should be wanting to establish the main character in the first few issues, not his supporting cast.

That's my opinion, however, there are those saying that it was a bad issue just for the fact that it was wordy. Of course, the opinion of the ADD crowd is not one that I take seriously for the simple fact that they lack common sense (in my view) in their purchasing habits. The books now cost 3-4 USD and a good amount of them take 5 minutes or less to read. Seriously, they put down more money for less content, argue that more books should be that way, and criticize those that aren't. In short, they're idiots.

I would imagine that George Perez was put in a difficult position with Superman, because he can't really reveal anything about the present Superman without interfering with Grant Morrison's plans. That's different from when Perez relaunched Wonder Woman, because he had total control over Diana and how her character developed.

That would explain why he chose to concentrate on Superman's surrounding characters and their situations, where he would have a freer hand.

It's kind of unfair of DC to put creators in these difficult positions. That's why a full reboot would have been better. Then all DC comics could start at the same point and show how all these characters developed. This relaunch is sort of like One Year Later, where DC was being coy about the different heroes and their relationships--in an effort to keep readers guessing--but it's hard to coordinate that kind of thing across several titles.

The early days of the Byrne/Wolfman Superman were quite enjoyable, because you could follow the development of the character through Superman, Action, and Adventures of Superman, without any gap. But even then, I think the DCU suffered for not being a full reboot.

I don't like these halfway measures. Either stick to established continuity and find ways to use it in new and creative ways, or do a full reboot and start all over again with everything. But don't try to have it both ways.

DC set him and any future team on the book up for failure then. They should have had Morrison's introductory arc run through both titles with enough artists on standby to keep from getting behind schedule and quickly set up the new status quo.

These problems are only going to continue if Morrison and Morales fall behind schedule, as both have done so in the recent past.

Of course, DC screwing up a relaunch is a common occurrence.

I'm glad they went with the look that Morales did for Clark Kent in Action Comics, makes his secret identity a bit more convincing. I'm sick of people complaining of how "his disguise stinks"

I'm pretty sure it was Superman #714, which was a nice capstone (http://superman.nu/tales5/714/) to the Bronze/Iron/Mercury Age (http://superman.nu/portal/History/Mercury/) Superman.

I am absolutely flabbergasted that Giffen and Jurgens will be taking over the new Superman title.  If Chris Roberson were the new writer, I'd be excited.

Well at least Jurgens is doing the art (and he's a pretty good artist) and I'm actually fan of Giffen's run on Justice League International. So hopefully it will be fine.

Not sure how long the forum has been back, but I'm glad!

I just finished reading through several of the new 52 titles. I'll read the new Action Comics, but not the new Superman. Aquaman, Green Lantern, and Justice League all look very interesting. Supergirl might end up being okay, but this is her 5th reboot since Crisis, and this isn't as good as the last one.

Detective Comics: no. I won't be reading the bat-books. They've basically taken on the Heath Ledger characterization of the Joker, times ten...a serial killer who tortures people to death with a knife. With that characterization, it's immoral for Batman to not have killed him already, since the joker seems to have already killed about 100 people as the issue opens.

One title I haven't read that I'm usually interested in is Swamp Thing...is it any good?

Dan's art is fine, he just needs the right inker to back him up. Unfortunately, the guy that does most of Jurgens' inking duties now is Norm Rapmund. The finished art just doesn't look as good as it did when Brett Breeding or Joe Rubinstein were on inking duties.

Examples:

Jurgens/Rapmund

(http://cdn.comicartfans.com/Images/Category_10618/subcat_99918/SUP.700.02.jpg)

Jurgens/Breeding

(http://cdn.comicartfans.com/Images/Category_4482/subcat_32097/sup74pg8.jpg)

Aquaman was the best one I've read actually and thats just because it has Aquaman answering all those "snide jokes" fanboys make about ol Aquay (or whatever his nickname is...we got supes, wondy, bats, GL...and aquay)

I like that they have Aquaman doing surface stuff. That was always my problem with the guy. Keeping Aquaman in the water is like keeping thor in asgard. Sure he can go their and have adventures there but he's gotta go to Earth some times

Perez's Superman was as over written as I assumed. Its nice that it takes awhile to read a comic but this was a bit much. I have a feeling that DC is sticking the screws to "Superman" writers because Morrison is the star on Action.
Seems kinda similar to when Morrison was on X-Men. (then again I don't really know how these things work)