John Byrnes Superman

[Tonyman1989]

I have been looking everywhere fo info on how strong John Byrnes Superman is here is what i got so far (with figures).

1. DC Whos who says that he can easily lift the weight of the great pyrimad (5,750,000 tons)

2. In Superman man of steel #2 He easily lifts a space that easily weighted 150,000 tons.

3. Action comics #585 he lifts a mountain that is the size of metropoiles and it weighted 40 billion tons (he does it with great differculty).

Dosnt anyone have any info on the peak strength of John Byrne Superman.

[Super Monkey]

The main focus of this site is the pre-crisis Superman of the Golden, Sliver and Bronze Ages. So you might be better off or have better luck finding the answer on DC's own Superman boards than here.

[Klar Ken T5477]

Or at the John Byrne Forums.

[Gangbuster]

I would pit 40 billion tons as hit peak strength under Byrne then.

Granted, the last ten years has seen a Silver-Age Redux period, where Superman has become more powerful. He was at his weakest under John Byrne. I divide the last 20 years of Superman stories into two periods:

1985 (Crisis)-1995 is the Iron Age where Superman retained the characteristics that Byrne gave him. 1996 (Kingdom Come)- Present has been undoing Byrne as much as possible, through the efforts of Mark Waid and Jeph Loeb, mostly.

[nightwing]

Byrne's just like every other creator in this respect: he may have started out with a clear idea of the limits of Superman's powers, but they were subject to change as the storyline demanded.

It's been my experience that when pros and fans (like Byrne) complain about Superman being "too powerful" what they really mean is that he doesn't get beat up enough.  Byrne "solved" this by having Superman's clock cleaned on a regular basis.  If fans had been clamoring for the sight of Superman with bruises, a bloody lip or torn clothes this period was paradise.

Could Byrne's Superman have moved the Earth out of its orbit?  It's hard to imagine, but if he wrote a story where it had to be done, I'll bet good money Superman would have pulled it off.  Certainly in the years since Byrne left the books, his "de-powered" Superman has risen to his Silver Age power levels or higher.  And yet he still gets beat up.  So it looks like they found a way to have their cake and eat it too.

Bottom line is I don't put much stock in references that claim to nail down the power levels of any given character.  Depending on who's writing the story, it goes up and down all the time.  This week Superman beats Thor, next week it could go the other way based on the writer's bias, the story the book's appearing in or a hundred other variables.

[MatterEaterLad]

I don't get "power level" at all...it seems like a video game quantification that's not very interesting...

[nightwing]

I don't get "power level" at all...it seems like a video game quantification that's not very interesting...

It's also very limiting.  Why establish exactly how powerful every character is, and then have to stick to it?  It doesn't add to the fun of battles, it takes away from them...how can it be fun if you know from the start who must win?

I never knew why this stuff appealed anyway, but it goes way back.  Even when I was a kid (when dinosaurs ruled the Earth) I had a friend who was obsessed with arguing whether the Hulk could beat Superman.  I always said "no" and he would come up with all sorts of examples of the Hulk's feats of strength.  Finally I said, "So what? The Hulk is a mental two-year old.  He could be the most powerful creature in the Universe but if he's too stupid to know his left foot from his right, Superman will beat him every day of the week."

He never liked that answer.

[ShinDangaioh]

Byrne's just like every other creator in this respect: he may have started out with a clear idea of the limits of Superman's powers, but they were subject to change as the storyline demanded.

It's been my experience that when pros and fans (like Byrne) complain about Superman being "too powerful" what they really mean is that he doesn't get beat up enough.  Byrne "solved" this by having Superman's clock cleaned on a regular basis.  If fans had been clamoring for the sight of Superman with bruises, a bloody lip or torn clothes this period was paradise.

And those same people make the complaint that if Batman can't take down everyone, it is bad writing.  :roll:

They have to tear Superman down both physically and emotionally because he is so bright.  

They think standing for hope, fun, and life are unreallistic goals and are obscene to write about.  Yuck.

The powers were not the real heart of Superman.  His compassion and love for a planet that gave him a home, after his homeworld blew up, is the heart of Superman.  Byrne doesn't get that.

Superman is a man of great love and great hate.  

If I could ever find it, there is this excellent story where the Parasite starts draining the world of its emotional support of Superman.  Superman was able to beat the Parasite after looking into a photo alblum and a picture of the Kents.

A misremembered quote:

"The people who gave me the most support are beyond his his grasp."

The new Superman might have a lot of physical strength, but he is so wishy-washy.