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Author Topic: What Post-Crisis elements would you KEEP?  (Read 24771 times)
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JulianPerez
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« on: August 11, 2005, 05:26:05 AM »

MatterEaterLad started an interesting thread a while ago about what in the previous to modern Superman incarnations didn't work, and this yielded some fairly interesting discussion.

As it seems we're now on the cusp of a new cyclical Superman Age, my question is this: what about the previous decades would you KEEP?

Nobody is a larger lampooner of the lame, larcenous, ludicrous lineage of Byrne's laconic leadership. It's been gone over and over what about the modern apocryphal variation of the character didn't work. But nothing is 100% worthless (though the Mike Carlin-helmed run was fairly clueless).

What about Superman after '86 shouldn't be '86ed?

Some might disagree (and be sure to tell me so) but here's my list of things the Modern Age gave Superman  that were additions instead of subtractions.

Maxima

Maxima has something that very few villains created in recent times possess: a motivation. That is, there is an answer to the question, "what is it they want?" For Maxima, the answer is simple: she wants Superman, the mightiest man in the universe, to be her baby-daddy. Sort of like those girls you knew in High School that went after the Captain of the Football Team, not because she liked him, but because he was Captain of the Football Team. Because her motivation is not truly antisocial, it places Maxima in the company of comics' "complicated" villains that are only partially bad, along with the Sub-Mariner and Magneto. Her emotions are legitimate: a combination of adoration and hatred, her spurning turning to spite. Superman doesn't have a weakness for women, and he isn't tempted by her for a second, which makes her frustrated; their relationship is more TAMING OF THE SHREW than SAMPSON AND DELILAH.

And what was Maxima's profession again? A serial killer? Nope. A corporate leader or suit-wearing underworld crimeboss? Nope. A mercenarial hired gun who is a superb martial artist and marksman? Nope. She was the beautiful queen of a super-scientific planet. Does it GET more old school space opera than that? For the love of Rao, she even has fins on her shoulders. Maxima is a throwback to the Silver Age and not a product of the Modern Age.

Maxima had interesting powers: molecular manipulation, telepathy, Mind Bolts; very visual, uncommon, "sexy" superpowers that one can imagine giving even Superman a run for his money, and there are few enough characters in the DC Universe (or even in fiction in general) that could even approach a grandiose, visual SUPERMAN II-style brawl with the Man of Tomorrow. No writer however, has written her powers very intelligently or had her use them in a particularly intriguing manner, but that does not mean a door is not open for that to exist.

...Also, is it just me, or are there no women in Superman's Rogue's Gallery?


Superman's Kryptonian Battlesuit

This may be a very shallow reason to have something survive, but boy, did that thing ever look neat; a ten foot giant robot with disintigration-vision. Most technology used in Modern Age comics have the James Bond business-class aesthetic: things being little and neat and disguised as other things. This one though, was the exact opposite: it looked huge and imposing, something one can imagine out of BUCK ROGERS or that Kirby would draw fighting the Fantastic Four. It just looks great as a Fortress of Solitude decoration and as a practical weapon, where Superman can drive it by remote control.


Superman's Robot Butler

For the life of me I can't remember what that thing was called. "Kylax" or something. Anyway, the point is Superman has a robot butler - how cool is that? It's cool in a kid wish-fulfillment sense that the Fortress of Solitude (the world's best treehouse) and the Interplanetary Zoo (the world's best pet collection) are.

Yes, Superman has his extremely cool Decoy Robots, but there's no reason the two can't overlap; he has a robot with a pop out chest that pours him some "Super-Coffee" while he reads books with his X-Ray Vision in a distant Parisian library, while prepping the Supermobile for a trip inside the Sun. At the same time, the Decoy Superman Robots help him keep his secret identity. One's an adventuring tool, the other is a major-domo.


Ron Troupe

I almost hate to say it, but Superman needs a black member of his supporting cast. If somebody could give Ron a personality, he could be able to do that. He doesn't deserve to be eliminated, just given a personality transplant and a niche that nobody else has filled.


Riot

A gift by the classy Louise Simonson to Superman. Riot had a superpower (Multiplicity or Super-Duplication or whatever the term is) that meant he was one guy that could become thousands and so could make mischief even for a guy like Superman. The story possibilities here are endless. Riot, too, has a clear motivation: he wants a good night's sleep. Riot can't sleep, because his telepathic rappaport with his Duplicates means constant chatter. Best of all, it's easy to insert Riot into a story even if he was captured, killed, or placed in the Phantom Zone the previous story; there are always more Riots out there somewhere. There's no need to pulll a "Ha! That was a clone of my robot duplicate of my evil twin!"
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« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2005, 05:38:49 AM »

Steel

Not the current version that DC messed up, but the poorman's Iron Man version Smiley as he was 1st introduced.  

To see how this would work, read this on-line comic:

http://superman.nu/tales3/typical/
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« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2005, 07:29:59 AM »

Steel/John Henry Irons is a keeper.

The tesseract Fortress? Love it.

The enormous range of art styles used (McGuinness, Benes, Ferry, Mahnke, Gammill, McLeod, Ordway, Weiringo)? Keep it. Just make sure the guys who suck don't get let in (Bog, Kano, Guichet, Rodier, etc.).

Lobo as a baddie? It works. Keep him.

Manchester Black? Wasted potential. Bring him back and turn him into a major supervillain player.

Amok? Good idea, wasted in one issue. Again, build him up into a major baddie with some serious firepower.

The red and black S-shield? I actually like it better than the standard yellow. Give Superman a black belt with a metal-finish buckle and take the logo off the cape (sound familiar?), and you'd have a cool retro-update to the costume.

The rainbow blur effect when Superman hits warp speed? Come on, you gotta love that.

Doomsday can stay so long as he's a henchman for either Darkseid or Brainiac. Otherwise he stinks as a solo villain and shouldn't be bothered with.

The rest can be chucked to the curb for all I care.
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Genis Vell
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« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2005, 08:56:17 AM »

I'm a fan of the post-Crisis, so there are lot of things which I like.
My favorite elements are:

- Only Green K (then, Loeb introduced serveral new types).
- The Superman/Batman relationship.
- No absurd powers like Super ventriloquism and Super hypnosis.
- Certain new characters like Cat Grant, Prof. Emil Hamilton and Ron Troupe.
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« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2005, 02:19:28 PM »

There's only two things I'd keep:

1) Jerry Ordway's art
2) Clark Kent's wardrobe (what a nice change to see him wearing a different, even stylish suit every day instead of that one, tired blue suit with red tie)
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« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2005, 02:44:58 PM »

John Henry Irons....

and that's about it.
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Johnny Nevada
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« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2005, 03:04:39 PM »

Stuff I'd keep:

- the Kents could stay alive, I guess.

- the supporting cast (Maggie Sawyer, Ron Troupe, Steel, a new Superboy, etc.)

- guess Lex as a businessman could stay as well (with a transition from the mad-scientist incarnation into said role, vs. a wholesale retcon; granted, the first two points above could be covered via some explanation instead of a retcon as well, I imagine [say the Kents really were "really" just in some sort of suspended animation that only made everyone *think* they were dead? And it's not like Supes doesn't meet new people all the time. Plus, nothing to stop someone from trying to clone Supes anyway, with the benefit of a world that'd keep comparing the new Superboy to the "old" one...])

Otherwise, I say hose the rest of it down with "Dip"... ;-)
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MatterEaterLad
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« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2005, 03:54:52 PM »

Just aspects of Superman I guess, I don't mind him de-powered from his maximum levels, don't mind him needing a source of air (and maybe sometimes propulsion) in order to move through deep space, and I too wouldn't hate a transition of Luthor into a businessman...I think of Superman as more of physical super hero (though intelligent), so hypnotism can go, though I actually think that super ventriloquism is a more realistic power than his powers of icy cold breath (etc).

I actually liked Bruce Timm's STAS version, still pays respect to a Superman I can identify with...
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