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Author Topic: Who can kick Superman's butt?  (Read 25593 times)
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Super Monkey
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« Reply #16 on: August 02, 2004, 03:40:22 PM »

Quote from: "Rugal 3:16"


but if we do the math here, Pre-supes has potentially infinite strength (same with the hulk).


Hulk does not.

as seen here :


Sliver Surfer also did something like that by blocking Hulk's Hammer punch (that's two punches at once,. hulk best attack) with his fingers and just holding his hands together with his figures, then he just drained his power.


But you are right about Pre-supes having potentially infinite strength.
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darkmark90
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« Reply #17 on: August 02, 2004, 04:48:50 PM »

Here's some possibilities:

MONGUL:  Definitely has the edge in strength, but not so much that Supes can't hurt him.

FAORA HU-UL:  Not as strong as Supes, but an absolute mistress at Horu-Kanu, the deadliest Kryptonian martial art.  When she met Superman in an ACTION COMICS trilogy, she mastered him.

DARKSEID:  Not anywhere near as strong or as fast as Superman, but possesses the deadly Omega Effect which can transport...or destroy...just about anything.

SPECTRE:  Way above Superman's level of power.  As shown in a DCCP story, Superman put his fist right through the Spectre's body and Spec left it there, unperturbed, and took him where he wanted him.  

DR. FATE:  Not as physically powerful, but a master of magic.  In JLA #38, Fate dealt out a magic punch to a substitute Superman and knocked him out.

LORD SATANIS:  Not as physically powerful, but his magic powers give him the ability to destroy Superman.

MORDRU:  Just about the most powerful sorceror, magically and physically, in existence.  Superman is more physically powerful than Mordru, but even Mon-El's Sunday punch failed to knock him out once.  Powerful enough to take on the Legion, the JLA, and the JSA all at once...and has.

ANTI-MONITOR:  Powerful enough to take on the Spectre in a hand-rassle.  He almost killed Superman in battle in CRISIS #7, and he DID kill Supergirl.  Thankfully, he died.

KRYPTONITE KID / MAN:  Not physically strong, but his radiation gives him the power to kill any Kryptonian in a relatively short amount of time.

Plus there's any number of equally-powerful foes that can give Superman a good fight, such as the Phantom Zoners, the Bizarros, the Daxamites, d the Quarrmer, Black Adam, Captain Marvel, and Captain Thunder.  But Superman's strength is greater than J'onn J'onzz's or Wonder Woman's, and even above the level of the Hulk's.
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I'm a BIG writer of fanfic, much of it about Supergirl but covering lots of characters in lots of comic universes.  Check the stories out at http://Dark_Mark.tripod.com/darkmark1.htm and at http://darkmark90.tripod.com/darkmark2.html .
Brainiac44
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« Reply #18 on: August 02, 2004, 10:49:53 PM »

I never understood why Kryptonite Kid never got to kill Superman (might have something to do with sales...).  If you're made of kryptonite or surrounded by it, you just hang on to Superboy...

P.S. Gang, I've really facelifted my site with animations and stuff - have a look!
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llozymandias
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« Reply #19 on: August 03, 2004, 12:54:52 AM »

Actually the pre-crisis Superman did defeat his Mongul once.  It was in DC Comics Presents (i don't remember the issue number) Mongul was using a Sun-Eater to get revenge on Superman by destroying Earth's sun.  The LSH was there to help.  They were unable to stop Mongul.  Wildfire destroyed Mongul's Sun-Eater.  Superman was able to knock Mongul out.  Granted that took all his strength to do, but he did it.  

   In the first Lexor story Luthor was able to beat a non-powered Superman.  also lex knows of ways to acquire powers equal to superman.  and in one superboy story he stole superboy's powers.  Lex has adapted brainiac's forcefield technology.   iow lex can kick superman's butt.
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John Martin, citizen of the omniverse.
Rugal 3:16
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« Reply #20 on: August 04, 2004, 02:24:45 AM »

Quote from: "Gernot"
In "The Man Who Has Everything", wasn't Superman mad enough to kill Mongul?  Mongul was still able to take what Superman was dishing out, and if not for Robin's interference, wasn't Mongul about to win their battle?    


That's because back in the bronze age, DC gave writers their own creative freedom to portray supes as powerful (or as weak) as they like to be depending on the story..

Seriously take all of that silver age strength that juggles planets, and a sneeze that blows away solar systems..

And apply all those force in a single punch against Mongul?? no mongul would be dead.. no butchered

And no matter what speed mongul can compensate.. Supes didn't use a light speed onslaught..

Indicating that this alan moore written superman is written creatively free to be weaker.

Jim Shooter wrote a story in which "Solomon Grundy" oa all people KO'ed Supes... another proof of creative freedom..

But to see which is accurate, the strongest portrayal has to be the most valid bacause it showcases actual feats and their peak..

BTW Mongul can't fly....
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Otenami Haiken to iko ka
Rugal 3:16
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« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2004, 02:27:16 AM »

Quote from: "darkmark90"
Here's some possibilities:

KRYPTONITE KID / MAN:  Not physically strong, but his radiation gives him the power to kill any Kryptonian in a relatively short amount of time.


And Supes can see him from a mile away and freeze him with super breath and take him to jail before the ice melts.. all in seconds. Kryptonite Kid can't fly..

Quote

Plus there's any number of equally-powerful foes that can give Superman a good fight, such as the Phantom Zoners, the Bizarros, the Daxamites, d the Quarrmer, Black Adam, Captain Marvel, and Captain Thunder.  But Superman's strength is greater than J'onn J'onzz's or Wonder Woman's, and even above the level of the Hulk's.


And Thor's too.
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Otenami Haiken to iko ka
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« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2004, 05:59:32 PM »

I remember a DC Comics Present story where Mongul gets control of a Sun-Eater.  Mongul trashes the JLA and Supergirl combined including Hal/GL.

Jimmy calls the Legion and they send a team to the present to assist Superman.  Only Wildfire causes Mongul any pain and still is just a distraction.  Superman ends up going all out to beat Mongul one-on-one, albeit he collapses into unconsciousness himself after scoring the win.
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Captain Kal

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« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2004, 06:42:09 PM »

Quote from: "Rugal 3:16"
Jim Shooter wrote a story in which "Solomon Grundy" oa all people KO'ed Supes... another proof of creative freedom..


That seems to be a consistent theme with Grundy.  EVer since Grundy gave Superman trouble in a JLA/JSA team-up due to his having absorbed magical energies from fighting Doctor Fate and Alan Scott/GL, he's been portrayed as a Superman-level opponent.  Of course, going by a Parasite/Grundy story, that could very well be because of Superman's holding back reflex keeping him from fully utilizing his abilities.  If he had the same inhibitions and levels of a normal man, he'd probably be way more powerful than Grundy in normal circumstances.

A Superboy encounter with a Tharok trap has him escape by realizing he normally holds back so he stops doing so to break out of said trap.
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Captain Kal

"When you lose, don't lose the lesson."
-- The Dalai Lama
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